January 3, 2009
Tengku Razaleigh: “…maybe I disagree with most things. It does not mean that I should not be a Member of UMNO”
by Aidila Razak
As a vocal critic of UMNO, veteran politician Tengku Razaleigh Hamzah, as some believe, should again turn his back on the grand old party and join the opposition. But according to the Gua Musang MP, his disagreements with UMNO are not enough to take him across the political divide.
“Certain things I agree with, but maybe I disagree with most things. It does not mean that I should not be a member of UMNO,” said Razaleigh, who described himself as a “free thinker” in the party.
In an interview with Malaysiakini last week, Razaleigh also explained why the recent constitutional amendments 
would do little to free UMNO of its corrupt image, which caused the ruling BN coalition to suffer an unprecedented setback in the March 2008 elections.
He said that any meaningful change that is to take place in the country’s most powerful political party can only happen if its members can wean themselves off patronage politics.
“(The) attitude and the mindset of those UMNO chaps must change. They cannot be dependent on patronage all the time … and they must get rid of old bad habits,” he said.
The amendment also meant that the abolishment of the quota system in party elections, allowing Razaleigh the opportunity to contest for the top position. But this did not mean much to the man who in 1987 came close to ousting then UMNO president Dr Mahathir Mohamad for the party leadership.
“It doesn’t meet half of what I have proposed. I had proposed that every member should be given the right to select their leaders through a fair election,” he said.
Excerpts of the interview follow, with contents edited for the purpose of brevity.
Malaysiakini: After (opposition leader Anwar Ibrahim) invited you to join the (oil royalty) caucus, people are wondering what’s next. Have you been invited to join Pakatan?
Razaleigh: Why should I join Pakatan? I’m very happy where I am. (Laughs) I think Pakatan does not have enough places even for their own people.
Have they talked to you about it?
No, never.
But you have heard people talking about it?
Actually (Pakatan Rakyat coalition advisor Zaid Ibrahim) did make an overture once in his blog, but that’s about all. Zaid said all sorts of things, anyway.
What is your opinion about the Common Policy Framework (CPF) which they launched recently?
I’ve not even seen it.
So you’re not interested in it.
Not that I’m not interested. I’ve just not seen it.
Last week Pakatan had a convention and they presented a joint policy which looked very like a manifesto.
So because of that I should join Pakatan?
No, we just wanted to know your views on it. So the presumption is that you will remain with UMNO.
You can never tell the future. I may be dead tomorrow. (Laughs)
How do you see your place in UMNO today?
Let’s put it this way, I am a free thinker. I like to take the middle road in UMNO. Certain things I agree with, but maybe I disagree with most things. It does not mean that I should not be a member of UMNO.
About the next party elections, all this while the quota system has stopped you from contesting, but it has now been abolished.
I’m not influenced by that. I had offered myself even with the quota system in place. It does not bother me the least. The problem is money politics. If people don’t use money and corrupt the delegates, probably I may have a chance.
Do you plan to run (for president in the party elections) again?
It’s too far ahead to know, isn’t it?
Some people plan far ahead.
Ah, they are lucky people. (Laughs)
Will all these amendments to the UMNO constitution revive the party and help regain the people’s support?
It doesn’t meet half of what I have proposed. I had proposed that every member should be given the right to select their leaders through a fair election. But on top of all that, I think the attitude and the mindset of those UMNO chaps must change. They cannot be dependent on patronage all the time. They cannot be dependent on handouts and get rid of the old bad habits. The leaders must also buck up and change in a positive way.
They should read the signals sent by the people in the 2008 general elections if they want to stay in power. I’m not saying they will lose power but if they continue on the trend in which they have been conducting themselves, if they are not careful, they may be thrown out of office.
It’s not just about tinkering with the party constitution here, there and everywhere. It does not meet the expectations of a lot of people. Even the attitude and the lifestyles of the leadership ought to change. It ought to change and be responsive to the feelings of the people on the ground.
The opposition is in disarray anyway at the moment, and you want me to join Pakatan?
Maybe they will unite under you.
Oh, my God.
Some people have said that with the way the country is going, we are heading the way of Zimbabwe. Do you think that’s true?
The difference (between the two countries is) that in Zimbabwe they have (Robert) Mugabe. (Laughs).
Is that the only difference?
Oh definitely. He is dark compared to the leaders here.
People say we are like Zimbabwe because of the way the Court of Appeal has judged. The Kota Seputeh, Perak and a number of other issues lately has seen the appellate court overruling the High Court.
Yes, it’s unfortunate. I don’t agree with those decisions anyway. I think they have not interpreted the constitution, or the law, in the spirit in which it was written.
Everyone is waiting for the Federal Court to make its decision on the Perak issue (on who is the rightful menteri besar). What’s your prognosis on that?
I think they have no right to get rid of the (Pakatan) menteri besar without the formal vote of no confidence.
They should reinstate (ousted Perak Menteri Besar Nizar Jamaluddin)?
I’m not saying anything about reinstating. Why should he be thrown out in the first place? He shouldn’t be thrown out because it is common knowledge that constitutionally an assembly like Perak should not get rid of their menteri besar without due regard to the feeling of the elected councillors. These people should have a say.
Have you talked to the Perak Sultan about this?
The conversations between the Perak Sultan and I are private.
THE RAZALEIGH INTERVIEW
Part 1: Razaleigh dismisses KPIs as a waste of time
Part 2: For Ku Li, striking oil has turned into a curse
Part 3: To GST or not to GST?
Part 4: Despite his views, Ku Li still loyal to Umno
should once again turn his back on the grand old party and join the opposition.
But according to the Gua Musang MP, his disagreements with Umno are not enough to take him across the political divide.
“Certain things I agree with, but maybe I disagree with most things. It does not mean that I should not be a member of Umno,” said Razaleigh, who described himself as a “free thinker” in the party.
In an interview with Malaysiakini last week, Razaleigh also explained why the recent constitutional amendments would do little to free Umno of its corrupt image, which caused the ruling BN coalition to suffer an unprecedented setback in the March 2008 elections.
He said that any meaningful change that is to take place in the country’s most powerful political party can only happen if its members can wean themselves off patronage politics.
“(The) attitude and the mindset of those Umno chaps must change. They cannot be dependent on patronage all the time … and they must get rid of old bad habits,” he said.
The amendment also meant that the abolishment of the quota system in party elections, allowing Razaleigh the opportunity to contest for the top position.
But this did not mean much to the man who in 1987 came close to ousting then Umno president Dr Mahathir Mohamad for the party leadership.
“It doesn’t meet half of what I have proposed. I had proposed that every member should be given the right to select their leaders through a fair election,” he said.
Excerpts of the interview follow, with contents edited for the purpose of brevity.
Malaysiakini: After (opposition leader Anwar Ibrahim) invited you to join the (oil royalty) caucus, people are wondering what’s next. Have you been invited to join Pakatan?
Razaleigh: Why should I join Pakatan? I’m very happy where I am. (Laughs) I think Pakatan does not have enough places even for their own people.
Have they talked to you about it?
No, never.
But you have heard people talking about it?
Actually (Pakatan Rakyat coalition advisor Zaid Ibrahim) did make an overture once in his blog, but that’s about all. Zaid said all sorts of things, anyway.
What is your opinion about the Common Policy Framework which they launched recently?
I’ve not even seen it.
So you’re not interested in it.
Not that I’m not interested. I’ve just not seen it.
Last week Pakatan had a convention and they presented a joint policy which looked very like a manifesto.
So because of that I should join Pakatan?
No, we just wanted to know your views on it. So the presumption is that you will remain with Umno.
You can never tell the future. I may be dead tomorrow. (Laughs)
How do you see your place in Umno today?
Let’s put it this way, I am a free thinker. I like to take the middle road in Umno. Certain things I agree with, but maybe I disagree with most things. It does not mean that I should not be a member of Umno.
About the next party elections, all this while the quota system has stopped you from contesting, but it has now been abolished.
I’m not influenced by that. I had offered myself even with the quota system in place. It does not bother me the least. The problem is money politics. If people don’t use money and corrupt the delegates, probably I may have a chance.
Do you plan to run (for president in the party elections) again?
It’s too far ahead to know, isn’t it?
Some people plan far ahead.
Ah, they are lucky people. (Laughs)
Will all these amendments to the Umno constitution revive the party and help regain the people’s support?
It doesn’t meet half of what I have proposed. I had proposed that every member should be given the right to select their leaders through a fair election.
But on top of all that, I think the attitude and the mindset of those Umno chaps must change. They cannot be dependent on patronage all the time. They cannot be dependent on handouts and get rid of the old bad habits. The leaders must also buck up and change in a positive way.
They should read the signals sent by the people in the 2008 general elections if they want to stay in power. I’m not saying they will lose power but if they continue on the trend in which they have been conducting themselves, if they are not careful, they may be thrown out of office.
It’s not just about tinkering with the party constitution here, there and everywhere. It does not meet the expectations of a lot of people. Even the attitude and the lifestyles of the leadership ought to change. It ought to change and be responsive to the feelings of the people on the ground.
The opposition is in disarray anyway at the moment, and you want me to join Pakatan?
Maybe they will unite under you.
Oh, my God.
Some people have said that with the way the country is going, we are heading the way of Zimbabwe. Do you think that’s true?
The difference (between the two countries is) that in Zimbabwe they have (Robert) Mugabe. (Laughs).
Is that the only difference?
Oh definitely. He is dark compared to the leaders here.
People say we are like Zimbabwe because of the way the Court of Appeal has judged. The Kota Seputeh, Perak and a number of other issues lately has seen the appellate court overruling the High Court.
Yes, it’s unfortunate. I don’t agree with those decisions anyway. I think they have not interpreted the constitution, or the law, in the spirit in which it was written.
Everyone is waiting for the Federal Court to make its decision on the Perak issue (on who is the rightful menteri besar). What’s your prognosis on that?
I think they have no right to get rid of the (Pakatan) menteri besar without the formal vote of no confidence.
They should reinstate (ousted Perak Menteri Besar Nizar Jamaluddin)?
I’m not saying anything about reinstating. Why should he be thrown out in the first place? He shouldn’t be thrown out because it is common knowledge that constitutionally an assembly like Perak should not get rid of their menteri besar without due regard to the feeling of the elected councillors. These people should have a say.
Have you talked to the Perak sultan about this?
The conversations between the Perak sultan and I are private.
THE RAZALEIGH INTERVIEW
Part 1: Razaleigh dismisses KPIs as a waste of time
Part 2: For Ku Li, striking oil has turned into a curse
Part 3: To GST or not to GST?
Part 4: Despite his views, Ku Li still loyal to Umno
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